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PH Drop Grrr...


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#11 wah wah

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Posted 21 May 2016 - 05:58 PM

Can you get a look at the roots?...any smell.?


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#12 TheGreenMachine

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Posted 21 May 2016 - 06:04 PM

Hi Wah Wah,

It's not easy let's put it that way lol.

What I will say is the last time I had the PH crash this extreme was a couple of weeks ago - just before we had those warm few days in fact.
I managed to lift the pot out enough then to see the mass of roots and they were all white and healthy looking.

When I go in the room there are no horrible smells or anything like that and I can't detect anything from the pot.

I think I'm gonna try and grab a look and see what's going on in there. It's the only way to be sure......


Back soon...



 


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#13 TheGreenMachine

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Posted 21 May 2016 - 06:14 PM

OK so I've sort of managed to get a peek but it wasn't a good view.

All I could see was down one side of the roots and they looked okay. A little staining from the red nutes but overall they were just slightly off white with a tint of red.
Stuck my nose in as best I could and took a couple of good sniffs but I couldn't smell anything.

I've topped her off with plain water for now and a good dose of silicone to raise the PH back into the green.

This plant's got me pulling my hair out lol

The crazy thing is, to look at her you wouldn't know there was anything wrong. Not a mark on her and as green as can be. Little heat curl on the edges but nothing extreme. No crisping etc.
She looks as healthy as anything :S

 


Edited by TheGreenMachine, 21 May 2016 - 06:16 PM.

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#14 wah wah

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Posted 21 May 2016 - 06:15 PM

You could empty out a cupful of your nute solution...that will give off a whiff if you,ve got the rot...but if you can get a look/smell of the roots all the better..fingers crossed for you...ah ok..just read^^...roots sound ok...hmmm..


Edited by wah wah, 21 May 2016 - 06:17 PM.

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#15 TheGreenMachine

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Posted 21 May 2016 - 06:17 PM

See my last post mate. We must have cross posted. :)


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#16 TheGreenMachine

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Posted 22 May 2016 - 06:07 PM

Yep it looks like it's rot alright.

PH drop overnight again. Took another look and tried to get in to see more. Looks like there's one or two cord roots that appear to have some brown on them where they come out the pot and go into the res.
The rest of the roots I can see look white and good so I dare say the worst of it is deeep in the root mass rather than round the sides. I can't smell any off smells though. Maybe a little fish tanky type smell but it's very faint.

Well, that's that then. If it's rot she'll never do her optimum now with that cr*p in there :(

 

What really upsets me the most is spending out all that money to refit the room stripping it back, cleaning the cr*p out of it, new gear etc for dedicated hydro, running bennies, keeping temps in check, upping the hygene and cleanlyness and wallop, it's like I may as well have done nothing.

I just don't understand how it's taken hold when I know I've done absolutely everything I can physically think of to eliminate the chances. The only time the res temp ever got above 20 was those couple of warm days just recently and yet she's been acting up since going into flower 5 weeks ago when the weather was still cool and the res temps were nice.

I just don't understand. And to confound me even more, she looks as healthy as can be. No dodgy leaves, all dark green and healthy but the PH and EC are just all over the hockey.

 

It's propper done my noodle in this has. Time for a blunt I reckon :(


 


Edited by TheGreenMachine, 22 May 2016 - 06:08 PM.

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#17 wah wah

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Posted 22 May 2016 - 06:34 PM

If it,s deffo rot..h2o2 at the ready, ...you say you have hard water...are you using hard water nutes?...just guessing really..know how you feel bud..the rot is soul destoying.


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#18 2scoops

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Posted 22 May 2016 - 06:37 PM

Cheers Jimmi.

I must be getting too fixated with the idea that the EC must go down and the PH must go up.

So when you say fill the res every 3 to 4 days do you mean leave it 3 - 4 days between topping it off rather than topping off every day or do you mean dump the res and add a fresh lot every 3 - 4 days?

At the minute, I top up every 24 hours and change the res every 7 - 10 days but that's because she drinks loads. 2 - 3 days between top offs and I reckon she'd be near dry.

While the res is 35L, it doesn't hold that amount now due to the huge root mass dominating the res. It's probably more like 20 - 25 liters after the root mass displacement.
In 24 hours she can drink 7 - 8 liters and that drops the waterlevel to around half way down the tube at the front of the farm.

When I got the farm I marked off 35L on the clear tube at the front and then marked off to the level which takes it to the bottom of the pot / basket. If I fill to the level of the basket, it's about half gone by morning which indicates how much of the space the roots are taking up. Mental lol



Cheers.

 

 

 Yes m8 just let the plant use whats in the rezz and when it needs topping up every 2 or 3 days then just do that and reset everything, once you know what the plant is feeding which you know is more or less1.3 - 1.4ec then so long as ph stays in the right range their should be no reason to fuck aboit every day and if you do at most maybe resetting the ph, i mean i`d say one of the reasons for having an automataed hydro system is so you can just fuck of and leave it and just refill and set ph as and when needs be, i`d go as far as saying thats 2nd reason behind yield only.. :)


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#19 2scoops

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Posted 22 May 2016 - 06:39 PM

I just read the rest :( Try dropping it to 1.2 EC.

 

1ml of pk 13/14 is plenty as well.


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#20 TheGreenMachine

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Posted 23 May 2016 - 06:56 AM

Cheers guys and cheers for all the help / advice etc.

 

I'm just gutted, stunned, cheesed off... And more besides. It's propper taken the wind out of my sails. I was so confident this was gonna be a rot free grow after all the hard work to prevent it. I really thought I was winning this time after so many failed rot grows before.
I don't even feel like I wanna go in there now but I went in this morning, saw the PH had dropped to below 5 again so I just threw in some tap water to bring the PH up and walked out. I just don't feel like bothering.

 

All my previous hydro attempts have ended in rot but back then I hadn't really put the effort in like I have now. This time I'd gone all out just for hydro (complete room strip and refit, new gear etc, cleaned, sterrilised, improved sanitation regime etc) with the sole purpose of avoiding rot. I'd hoped to finally do a single hydro plant that was big and fully healthy and green all the way to the end so I could get the most out of one plant. Now she's got rot that's all out the window. I just feel like I'm destined to get rot every single time I try hydro - that's how it seems to keep going.

I could accept it if I'd been slobbish and unclean but I went all out and what kicks me in the teeth the most is that it looks like she's had rot even when I first put her in flower 5 weeks back when temps wern't even an issue. The res temps were perfect right up until recently so I don't even think buying a chiller would have saved it or prevented it.

I really thougt I'd cracked it this time and what's worse is the plant looks amazing.

Well tonight I'm going to refill all my 50L bins. I'll be checking on the roots of the Kush I've got in veg first of all and if she's okay I'll keep her going and try and figure out how to keep her safe.

With the power plant in flower I'm just going to have to keep fighting the PH drop and the EC til the end. Nothing else I can do. Peroxide just slows the Rot down and since the damage is now done, it's not worth it.

I've got to be so careful now that if the Kush hasn't got rot, she doesn't get rot. Thankfully the res temps for the Kush have been around 17C but that clearly doesn't mean squat in my room given my Power Plant had good res temps and still got it :(


Oh well, at least I'll still have some Power Plant to smoke in a few weeks I guess. But I seriously need to find out why Rot is taking hold so easy every time I try......

 

The only thing I can possibly think of is lack of oxygen owing to the volume of root mass in there. I mean it's absolutely ram-packed in there. I've got four 4" golf ball airstones in the res powered by a 60L per minute mini compressor.
For a long time now I've not heard fizzing but more like blooop blllooop as it sounds like the air is building up in pockets before rising to the surface. Perhaps there's not enough oxygen or it's not being dissolved / distributed in the res properly?

I dunno, I'm just clutching at straws. I feel I've done all I can but obviously something isn't right.

Sorry for the ramble I just don't know what to do now. I felt so confident at first. Everything seemed to be going really well - too well and now wallop. Here, have some rot. :(


Time for a smoke and a good long hard think.......

Thanks again everyone and sorry for the waffle.


Edited to add:

Hmmm, thinking a little more about the oxygen in the res thing... I wonder if it's a case of the older the plant got, the more roots in the res so the less water it could hold so the less oxygen it could hold?
So the older the plant got, the worse it got. Which would sort of make sense as to why it started and got worse when it went from under the 125W CFL to under the 600W lamp. An explosion of root growth that slowly started to deplete the oxygen to the point it became favourable for rot? But then would the plant be green and healthy if it was barely getting enough oxygen?

Maybe I could try more airstones or bigger ones? Try and get more air in through that huge mass of roots. Hmmm....










 

 

 


Edited by TheGreenMachine, 23 May 2016 - 07:05 AM.

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